Handing, what handling?

As you all know, I am the newbie with the yellow Mille R, 2001 vintage. Now when I bought the bike the suspension settings were all to ****, but now having returned them to standard the bike still feels ****.
I'm refreshing the forks next weekend, with new oil and seals just to be sure, but my real concern is the tyres.

On the front is a Pirelli Diablo, with loads of life in the tread, but the makers date code is 2407, which donates the year of manufacture as 2007. On the rear is a Diablo Corsa III, on which I can find no date code, which equally has loads of meat left on it. The rear has a plug in it, something I didn't notice on purchase.

Now my problem is a lack of feel, I have no confidence in the grip, I am presuming that the rubber is past it's best. I have tried to research shelf life of tyres but to no real conclusion. What's your opinion?

I am considering a change to either the Metzeler M5 Interacts or Pilot Power 2CT's. Now I had the Metzeler M3's on my Cagiva Raptor 1000 and loved them but can find no real conclusive info on the M5's. The 2CT's I have no experience of.

I have never been a fan of Pirelli, apart from the infamous Phantoms when the only other choice was the equally infamous TT100's of yesteryear (I had these on a Z900, scary). Oh and by the way, I have read all the past tyre posts, but would like a fresh opinion as this is a handling query, When were the Corsa III avialable? Are these as out of date as my front?

Darren.

hi bud ,my mate swears by them 2ct thingies wet or dry he wont use anything else on a zx10r kwak
i run bt020`s on my mille and cant fault them

i think the harder sidewall helps on the twins

If your road riding 2ct's are a great tyre, as said wet or dry, fabulous

I'm considering getting Michelin Pilot Road 3. Touring tyres, yes, but I won't be much on a track anyway. Long lasting and really good on wet roads (according to tests). I have Metzeler Z6 Interact on my Gisser and been really happy with them. But since this is a new bke for me, I wanna try something new.

A set of Power Pures 2ct in a 180 for the rear, you wont look back:thumbup

my 01 rsvr has the 2ct's on. ive only had any movement when ive got a bit to cocky on wet roads, otherwise been fine.
what bike did you have before? i found when i first got my mille in feb that i had no feel for the bike, but i had just sold my relatively soft zx6r. i found that the ohlins suspension is great when going really fast, thats when you get your feedback. to get more 'normal' speed feel, i backed off compression and rebound and took some preload off from standard settings and softened the whole bike up until i bacame comfortable with the lower speed handling and feel, then gradually stiffened it up as i got used to it. now i have it set just slightly firmer then standard and that suits me fine for everyday riding and commute to work. give it time, i reckon its just that you need to adapt to the bike a little. i had to do the same and now i love this bike.

Likewise, when i had my '02 R it took me months to get use to the handling. For one i wasn't use to riding a bike with a steering damper! I took it off and things where fine, so i cleaned it up, sorted it out, and it was much better. I still had to have it at it least resistance, and even then i found the harder you ride it the better it becomes. When you get the feel for it and get in the zone its spot on.

How long have you been riding, and how long have you had the bike?

I,ve been riding since I was ten, and am now 43. I've had a rum variety of bikes, both on and off road ( XJ650, Z900 a couple of GPz11's, RG500, RM250, KTM 495 stroker to name a few) I swapped my CCM flatracker for this bike and still own a Husaberg 650 supermoto, mental when it works.
I only picked the bike up three weeks ago and have ridden it about five times, so early days, but then I know summits amiss.
The front forks were my first port of call as the preload was wound up to maximum :dunno, there was no preload on the rear. I am using all the fork travel on standard settings so will be throwing new oil and a set of seals at it this week. Once I know where I am and have a blank sheet so to speak, I can then fine tune the bike to me ( 13.5 stone in me birthday suit, courtesy of John Smiths).
It's the tyres which are the unknown, especially the age of them. I think I'll just have to bite the bullet and get some new ones to eliminate that factor as well. They must go off, they certainly don't feel that soft to the thumbnail. It's got a 190 on the back at the mo, what size are the Oz wheels, 190 generally go with 6" rims, 180 with 5.5" it says in the handbook that you can use both. The raptor I had used a 180, felt fine, after some serious mods to the chassis.

the 'r' with oz wheels should have the 180 section rear tyre. apparently the main reason for this is that the idea of the oz wheels is lightness, so fitting 190 section tyre is obviously heavier then 180, which would be kinda pointless! would be daft to have lightweight wheels only to then stifle them with heavy rubber.

tyre shelf life is around 4 years however this will depend on how they are stored and how long they have been fitted on the bike.

i think you have the right idea get rid of them!

the OZ's will take a 180 or 190 on the rear i've run both and find little difference

i have aslo run sports tyres and sports touring and grip wise there is no difference actualy there is a difference the sports touring tyres are confident from the word go.

i'm running Avon Storm's and get over 5k from the pair and have done a track day on them and they coped with that also.

The RSV's are different handling wise to any other bike I've had.

I would raise the rear and drop the yokes on the forks so you have four rings showing. This will put more weight on the front to aid feeling.

Oh and buy the way the Dunlop Sportsmarts are the best tyres you can buy at the mo IMO. Go for a 190 but make sure its a 55.

The accepted industry standard shelf life for a tyre is 6 years. This does not mean 6 years on a tyre fitters shelf and then fitted as new to your car or bike however. It is the total life of the tyre after which it should be changed. Most motorcycle tyre manufacturers tend to err on the safer side of 5 years once the tyre has been fitted though. This is why everyone should have some knowledge of the date coding on the tyre sidewall previously mentioned. Obviously a tyres life can be reduced if stored/used incorrectly. Storing it in direct sunlight, or exposing it to certain chemicals can ruin it in a matter of months. Riding with an under or over inflated tyre can have a serious effect on tyre life too.

Tyres, like people, age. The most noticeable aspect is the reduction of moisture content in the rubber compounds which can cause severe degradation in the carcass and, ultimately, allow the tread to be parted from it. Not something most riders would appreciate.

I run Pirelli Diablo Strada's on the Falco and they're great - even on track.

Here's a link to a site with even more info on tyres than my pish memory can be bothered dredging up.

http://www.carbibles.com/tyre_bible.html

I thought there was something up with my mille R originally. I've since fitted a set of mez racetecs (K1 front and K2 rear) and the thig has been transformed into something of wonder, even a mate who races got on and couldn't believe how good the ride was!

tyre shelf life is around 4 years however this will depend on how they are stored and how long they have been fitted on the bike.

i think you have the right idea get rid of them!

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The accepted industry standard shelf life for a tyre is 6 years. This does not mean 6 years on a tyre fitters shelf and then fitted as new to your car or bike however. It is the total life of the tyre after which it should be changed. Most motorcycle tyre manufacturers tend to err on the safer side of 5 years once the tyre has been fitted though. This is why everyone should have some knowledge of the date coding on the tyre sidewall previously mentioned. Obviously a tyres life can be reduced if stored/used incorrectly. Storing it in direct sunlight, or exposing it to certain chemicals can ruin it in a matter of months. Riding with an under or over inflated tyre can have a serious effect on tyre life too.

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Some interesting points raised here, I thought I was right on the tyres degrading.A new set it is then.

I would raise the rear and drop the yokes on the forks so you have four rings showing. This will put more weight on the front to aid feeling

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I have only three rings showing, makes sense, will try it once new rubber is fitted. I like to change one thing at a time, so that I can gauge the effect it has. You can always put it back then if it has an adverse effect.

i have aslo run sports tyres and sports touring and grip wise there is no difference actualy there is a difference the sports touring tyres are confident from the word go.

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I have often wondered about the validity of running sports tyres on the road. Can we, in reality, really keep the heat in them, what with traffic, caravans, tractors, traffic lights, 30mph zones etc, etc. It is a leap of faith to fit tyres that are not what the norm would be, i.e. sports bikes need sport tyres so to speak, but how often are we exploiting the advantages of the sports compound, probably running in conditions where the sport/touring would be more applicable.

what bike did you have before? i found when i first got my mille in feb that i had no feel for the bike, but i had just sold my relatively soft zx6r. i found that the ohlins suspension is great when going really fast, thats when you get your feedback. to get more 'normal' speed feel, i backed off compression and rebound and took some preload off from standard settings and softened the whole bike up until i bacame comfortable with the lower speed handling and feel, then gradually stiffened it up as i got used to it. now i have it set just slightly firmer then standard and that suits me fine for everyday riding and commute to work. give it time, i reckon its just that you need to adapt to the bike a little. i had to do the same and now i love this bike.

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Probably a fair bit of truth in this statement, I don't normally need a "dial myself into the bike" period. I think that once I have faith in the rubber, I can then sort myself out.

try setting it all back to the factory settings. I always get new rubber on a new bike, then you KNOW anything that doesn't feel right ISN'T right if that makes sense. Tyres are such a key part of it- if they are a mismatched pair that he has had 2nd hand off someone they will be worn differently, the puncture repair won't help at all. You don't know how many miles the tyres have done- 4000 miles on mine and they don't look flat but I know they aren't as steering friendly as they once were. I have Diablos, and have tried the corsa 3. I prefer the standard diablo- both are still available new btw.

Check the head race bearings, you can balance the front wheel off the ground by tipping the bike back towards you on the stand, slowly move the bars from lock to lock, if it's anything other than perfectly smooth & notch free they need replacing - has a massive affect on the handling

Just to say, I used to fit a 180 on my Mille because 'those in the know' said I should- despite all the tyre people saying a 6" rim should run a 190.
I found that I ran off the edge of the tyre and it got far too hot. The Mille is a heavy bike, remember!

I went for the same tyre but in a 190/55 (Dunlop D211 GP Racer) and would never look back.

jon_melson
Just to say, I used to fit a 180 on my Mille because 'those in the know' said I should- despite all the tyre people saying a 6" rim should run a 190.
I found that I ran off the edge of the tyre and it got far too hot. The Mille is a heavy bike, remember!

I went for the same tyre but in a 190/55 (Dunlop D211 GP Racer) and would never look back.

just out of interest jon, was that on a mille r, with oz wheels? i was tempted to change mine last time out of curiosity but thought it could turn out to be an expensive experiment if it turned out to feel a bit rubbish!

Bing-Bong said:

I have often wondered about the validity of running sports tyres on the road. Can we, in reality, really keep the heat in them, what with traffic, caravans, tractors, traffic lights, 30mph zones etc, etc. It is a leap of faith to fit tyres that are not what the norm would be, i.e. sports bikes need sport tyres so to speak, but how often are we exploiting the advantages of the sports compound, probably running in conditions where the sport/touring would be more applicable.

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This is where a fast road tyre comes in, something like the racetec K3 is ideal and comes up to temp very very quickly.

ninja609 said:

the 'r' with oz wheels should have the 180 section rear tyre. apparently the main reason for this is that the idea of the oz wheels is lightness, so fitting 190 section tyre is obviously heavier then 180, which would be kinda pointless! would be daft to have lightweight wheels only to then stifle them with heavy rubber.

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Here Here my bike is identical 2 yours i put a set of pirrelli super corsas on and its ace, dont put the fat tyre on,i have had my damper rebuilt cos it had siezed and although ive been riding it without one with no probs it is rather flighty so will put back on and only have it on second click ie hardly any damping, suspension has to be set spot on with these bikes and you need ten miles for things to start working properly , i have michelin road sports? on my bee em and i rate them also. happy safe riding