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Just had service and now stalls when warming up

Stuza

Stuza

Joined May 2008
136 Posts | 0+
London
Hey guys

as subject really. Not sure if I should be worried - im no spanner monkey! - so im looking for advice.

Just had the bike serviced by a non-aprilia dealer however, always been very happy with the dealers work. Since the service its really reluctant to stay running when warming up. The bike will start first time, every time but as i leave it idling to warm itself up it will slowly get slower and slower until it eventually stalls. If I hold the throttle open myself to keep it going (only maybe 2000rpm) I will hear a single "clunk" and also feel it through the throttle handle and then the bike will be fine. Im not sure if i should worry about this but I suspect I should. Once the bike is warm it doesn't stall and is fine and i never ride the bike until its warmed up to at least 120.

I've also noticed a bit of an increase in the popping and spluttering (nothing significant but it is more), specialy on the overrun - now whilst this makes it sound even better, should i be worried about it as it has changed?


The bike started perfect prior to the service and hardly popped.

Its a 2007 RSV-R Bol'Dor with Leo Vince pipes and has done about 6500 miles.

Thanks in advance! :thumbup
 
Almost certainly they have either left one of the small vac pipes off around the Tb's or they adjusted the Co incorrectly.

There is a distinctly correct way to do them which has been changed by several Technical bulletins since the Service manual was printed. As a non franchise it's possible they don't have a manual and did it via a vac guage and didn't stagger the cylinders or they didn't have the updates and set the Co/Vac to incorrect values.

The stalling/popping = running too lean, probably on the back cylinder if they didn't stagger it.

I'm assuming it's on Map 2 for the aftermarket cans right ?
 
hey

thanks for the very quick response! Yes it is on map 2. So, is this urgent? Should i be carefull or is it just going to be niggling little pain that needs to be adjusted soon'ish? Would you happen to know where I can get the bulletins from to aid the dealer

So many questions! :)
 
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It's likely to just make the bike run rough and maybe a few degrees hotter than normal especially in traffic. I wouldn't do any gp's until your sure it's ok though

Do check the vac pipes though as they come off easily and will cause much the same issue.
The tech bulletins are on Service Aprilia but only dealers have the password to access it.

essentially the C/o values changed in the update for map 2 in particular.

The Tb's are set by Co taking priority over vac. A Vac reading is taken via an Axone at a dealer merely to check for Vac leaks. On post 04 bikes both Tb's are linked by the auto idle control so the axone looks for a combined vac reading of 60 mba or therabouts, if it's much lower there is a leak.
Once satisfied the Vac is ok both bypass screws are grounded (wound right in) and the highest cylinder brought down to match the lowest Co wise. The rear cylinder is almost certainly the highest due to the stagger. As the Tb's are linked as the back Co comes down the front will go up and vice versa.
They need to switch between cylinders using a switchover kit until both meet in the middle at the same value. The guide value is between 2 -4% for Map 2 give or take a little.
when both cylinders match Co wise the vac stagger between cylinders will be correct. If you are confident the vac circuit is sound you can bypass the axone check at the beginning.
 
Oh yeah ... of course!:dunno:eek:


Seriously, i don't understand that BUT, i have given this link to the dealer and I hope it will make a lot of sense to them :biggrin


That said, I do understand this bit:
spoonz said:
It's likely to just make the bike run rough and maybe a few degrees hotter than normal especially in traffic. I wouldn't do any gp's until your sure it's ok though
Click to expand...

So, no rush then! Thanks very much for all the info!!!! :thumbup
 
That "clunk" you feel is probably a backfire up through the injector butterflies. They will do that if you hold the throttle open a bit whilst warming up.
You have to go with Spoons advice on this.
 
ooooo ... does that mean i should just let it stall and re-start it instead of holding it slightly open?
 
the what? I'll go and have a look at my bike now but I have no idea what your talking about ......
 
The fast idle. On the LH bar. It moves down when operated and looks like a choke lever. Give me 5 mins and I'll find a pic of one.
 
Nope. Dont think I have one of those mate. I suspect you may be talking about pre 2005 bikes? Mines a 2007. I even went as far as checking i had the correct "left" with a guy at work :rotfl

I dont have access to my host at work but I can upload a picture of my left switch gear when I get home.

I guess the question still stands then, let it stall a couple of times and keep restarting it or give it a small portion and ignore the butterfly-whatsit-thing backfire that will happen?


This is almost identical to mine and from the right of this, there is nothing (apart from the usual handlebar etc)

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/APRILIA-RSVR-...4?IMSfp=TL081114125001r33892#ebayphotohosting
 
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The later model bikes DONT have the fast idle lever !!. It sounds like a vacuum leak or the automatic fast idle has packed up/needs servicing (if possible).
One thing is for sure if you keep starting it the way you do you will wreck the sprag clutch and that will cost you around £500-00.
 
The auto idle is vacuum controlled. A map sensor measures the vac reading and and reports it to the ecu which than adjusts a stepper motor on the tb's to increase or decrease the throttle opening.

anything that disrpts the vac circuit will upset the idle be it a loose pipe or the Co setting. The co value has a direct link to vac etc.

The clue is the popping etc which indicates a lean condition either by vac leak or incorrect setup.
 
kiwi_rsvr said:
...it the way you do you will wreck the sprag clutch and that will cost you around £500-00.
Click to expand...


OK thanks. Thats the sort of info I need. Now I know its urgent, I will get in contact with the dealer that serviced it immediatley. I guess your saying use the "Start and stall, start and stall, start and stall" method? Probably only need to start and stall three times i guess?


Many thanks!


Also, thanks Spoonz :)
 
Hi stuza, if your no spanner monkey, and your in the London area why dont you take the bike to Southern Cross and let them have a looksey, they come highly recommended by other RSV owners on here :thumbup
 
Repetitive starting on V Twins is not good.

The sprag takes a beating when starting a poorly set up engine, get it back to the shop ASAP before it causes any damage.

Seconded that Southern Cross recommendation, these guys know the bikes inside out.
 
Yeah i know about Southern Cross and indeed I would if it wasn't about 15miles from me. The other factor is that any work would probably need to be left with them all day .... and well, thats a B*&*H for me to get to from my area. Sadly.

And no choice on the "starting of it"... a cab to and from work each day will cost me about £80, taking several days off (until its fixed) isn't an option either at over £300 each! Just need to know the least dangerous method of starting.

Have left them an answer machine message and also emailed the dealer. Fingers crossed they will get back to me asap.
 
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A stall condition is not as bad as a non starter sprag wise. Just don't hold it on the starter for any length of time if it won't start. From what you said it fires straight up as normal but just won't idle very well.

Any bike shop with a gas analyser should be able to do it for you. Ideally you need the switchover kit but an exhaust probe will get it ballpark. The main objective of the take offs for the switchover as well as a purer gas reading is that they are pre cat for bikes on standards cans. As you have not cats you can get round that for now.

If you make a conscious effort to hold the revs up a bit when idling you should be ok for a few days till it's sorted.
If you want to check the vac pipes yourself it's easy to lift the tank and they will be visible. The pipes easily left off are the 2 very thin pipes that run from the Tb to the sensor on the underside of the airbox. They are a push fit so no tools needed to locate them on the airbox.
 
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