Group buy suspension plates

OK is anybody interested in a group buy on the uprated suspension plates for 04 on bikes ..

am not sure where to get them from but am sure somebody on here will help with that .

i am told the plates are from usa and are approx £50 inc post ..

not sure if this is possible but gotta be worth a try me finks

wat say you lot ???????????

Kawasakiinit, Dave how's things mate? :thumbup Did this a couple of years ago on another forum. I bought in 6 sets from the USA for forum members. If you want my opinion, for what it's worth, I would junk the standard plates in a flash. Having taken my original plates off for inspection I crapped myself at the amount of scoring and grooves worn into each plate . Having had a long forum conversation with Spoonz it wasn't possible for him to obtain plates made by MPL or a titanium version he was trying to get made himself, so the only alternative was to go down the yanky route. If you want to go ahead and order the site you need is AF1 Racing and look under RSVR 2004 - 2009, then suspension parts, they are currently doing them for $50 plus P & P. Word of warning, Spoonz did warn me because there was 6 sets ordered that we might get hit with import tax, which we did, but on the whole even with the crap exchange rate I think this works out at an extra £10 per set. I still think they are well worth the dosh so as to have peace of mind whilst out enjoying your riding. If you are intersested in this and need any further information please do not hesitate in getting in touch. If you do get them and need a hand fitting them bring the bike down and it can be sorted over a cuppa.

SPOOKY :ghostface

What are they made of ? Aircraft spec ally? 6081? Bloody silly importing something that simple all the way from the states.

You could get some Laser cut from sheet cheaper than that and the more you order the cheaper it gets.

How are they different from the 2002 version? I gather the problem is wall thickness ( or lack of it) around the bolt holes?

SPOOKY said:

Kawasakiinit, Dave how's things mate? :thumbup Did this a couple of years ago on another forum. I bought in 6 sets from the USA for forum members. If you want my opinion, for what it's worth, I would junk the standard plates in a flash. Having taken my original plates off for inspection I crapped myself at the amount of scoring and grooves worn into each plate . Having had a long forum conversation with Spoonz it wasn't possible for him to obtain plates made by MPL or a titanium version he was trying to get made himself, so the only alternative was to go down the yanky route. If you want to go ahead and order the site you need is AF1 Racing and look under RSVR 2004 - 2009, then suspension parts, they are currently doing them for $50 plus P & P. Word of warning, Spoonz did warn me because there was 6 sets ordered that we might get hit with import tax, which we did, but on the whole even with the crap exchange rate I think this works out at an extra £10 per set. I still think they are well worth the dosh so as to have peace of mind whilst out enjoying your riding. If you are intersested in this and need any further information please do not hesitate in getting in touch. If you do get them and need a hand fitting them bring the bike down and it can be sorted over a cuppa.

SPOOKY :ghostface

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hey spooks

am good ta mate you ?..

am gonna see how it goes with the responce on here pal . i was thinking of going to an engineering shop and having some stainless ones made from the pattern of my original ones but thicker . are they thicker all over or just on the bolt holes as mentioned above ?

dave .......

Dave, first off, stainless ones were knocked in the head, something to do with the lack of flex which would result in more wear on the bearings in the dog bone etc. PM Spoonz for the details as he is more aware of the make up of the construction and stress levels of the plates involved. It would seem that it's a very poor quality ali alloy used (shot peened) in the first place and there's even a thought that the plates were wrongly constructed from the original drawings, if you look on Aprillia's parts fisch the picture clearly shows that the narrow upright on the very back of the plate has been cast where it should be on the upper run.

Killa, This has been going for some time now and with what has happened world wide I don't think Aprilia are going to throw their hands up and issue a recall for this problem any time soon.

IanG, You would not believe the crap we had trying to get plates made here in the UK, it was a total no go situation. Machine shops were just not arsed or just couldn't be bothered with the numbers involved.
If you have access to a machine shop that could knock these out, in said grade ali or better still Ti, I think it would be of a major service to the people on the forum.

Tim, I'm sure this only applies to post 04 machines, and for some strange reason the factory has more problems.


SPOOKY :ghostface

This shows the problem as all of the up and down forces are carried through the ****** or wrongly constructed thin end.



SPOOKY :ghostface

Well,getting them made is not an issue.If I needed a set for mine then yes I have the contacts.

The problems start with potential product liability issues and also if someone has a niggle then the problems that can arrive at the suppliers door are not nice , BUSEYWOO anyone?

Part of my last job used to be getting drawings made and ordering bits like these from the laser cutters in all sorts of materials. Strangely I do still have a copy of the Cad-Cam suite available irate and of course still have the contacts,suppliers names etc.

I agree about not using stainless for the reasons given and was going to say so but decided to hold back,the same goes for titanium as it will work harden then stress fracture.

Shot (or ball) peining is a treatment usually used on articles like steel con rods etc to compress and homogenise (sp) the surface skin to impart more strength and reduce stress raisers, not too sure about using it on aluminium for this application though.

Another point to consider about using thicker material plate is,will the standard bolts be long enough given that the nuts are nylocs requiring the thread to project through the locking collar?

If so, the plates could be made a different shape to leave more support around the problem area. This is measurable to a certain degree with finite stress analysis ( although I've never used this facility I've seen it demonstrated)

One of the main problems with the originals I think I'm right in saying ( and this is only something I read somewhere) is that on the later factory models with the Ohlins suspension Aprilia went overboard on the weight saving and compromised the strength, ALSO I believe there is an issue of the suspension components being machined out of line ie holes not being bored square or parallel which puts assymetrical loads in play and generates rubbing on the side links.

If this IS the case and I'm just going on what I've read on other forums etc then a complete remake is in order with correctly machined parts.

Taking the valve/cam timing timing issues that appear to have happened when Aprilia took over engine assy as an example I'm inclined to believe this could be the case. Their Quality control seems to leave room for improvement.

Given that this is currently before various courts internationally I'm not sure about the legal position if someone made and sold some replacement parts and they failed in any way. As a one off for my own bike,then thats my lookout,I have no desire to have a forum lynching party coming my way.


Having said that if someone has some old plates going spare and they were to find there way up here I could possibly take measurements, get some designed and get a price for the odd set for my personal use. (these might or might not end up going to friends for say EVALUATION purposes) :devious

Why,said friends might even shower 'gifts' on me to show their appreciation,:doug

Stainless will do the job as will Titanium but they weigh a ton in comparison to the originals or buy the af1/MPL versions. Whether the lack of flex is an issue with Stainless i have my doubts.

I have cad files somewhere if i can find them if anyone wants to make some for themselves.

I did actualy get a Titanium spec set made in the states by the same guys who make the rotor blades for american fighter jet engines. Garin has them on his bike , but they were not cheap or light.

I also Got Ally MPL versions but they were all used and MPL would need fairly big numbers to make me anymore so AF1 is the best bet. (made by Acculign)

On the stock part the rear leg width is about 8mm i think from memory and pre 04 it's 14mm so half the width pretty much.
All years used the same 6 series aluminium stamped from a sheet but post 04 they were shot peened also to increase their surface hardness and clean them up after stamping.

Whether anyone changes them for stronger versions is personal choice. I would if i were you.
Forget the court case and Aprilia sorting it for you. The court case will only settle Scott's personal claim (Scott took out the law suit) as the police in NZ backed out of the prosecution so whatever happens it will likely be a personal settlement only. Might have already happened but Scott is not allowed to say much about it.

Also the bike is out of produtction and the issue has been around since the first major crash in 05. Think Aprilia might have stepped up by now if they were going to.
Choice is either live with what you have or buy something else.

Mmmm. quite :eatcorn

That's what I'm saying,it's no big deal to get a batch cut by laser,obviously if you go to an engineering sub-contractor then they are going to add 20% at least on to make it worth while ( in fact unless they are desperate they would probably say it's still not worth the time and effort).

The best way is going direct to the cutters and hope they would do a batch as a cash job. That's where the contacts come in handy. :devious

Thinking about flexure, unless something is machined on the piss (technical term used by engineers to indicate discrepancy from tolerancing :biggrin) there should be no flexing as such,only shear forces acting thru the thickness of the plates. That being so just redesigning the shape to put more meat round the eye would seem to be adequate

The very fact that most used side plates that I have seen appear to exhibit wear patterns arround the holes shows there is some misalignment in the linkage.
This would be entirely in keeping with Luigi's somewhat haphazard approach to quality control I would think,however at the end of the day it's up to the individual owners as to whether or not they replace a 'mission critical' component with an untested aftermarket one.

Spoonz
I'll have the cad files if they're handy please. What format? Hopefully you should be able to save and send as a DXF,but if not I can except MasterCam,EdgeCam,or SolidWorks proprietry formats as I have all these suites at home. If not a dimensioned PDF or DWG would be ok and ill draw a solid model from scratch.

Ta very much

Foxb said:

Do you totally think that 316 stainless steel wont age/work harden then crack? Then all people need to do is remove their plates, use them as stencils on an easily bought piece of 6mm thick 316 and cut their own. Surely better than postage from the US????

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Just thinking,if you don't have a machine shop at your disposal can I come and watch while you ' cut your own' out of 6mm 316? :devious

I could do with a bit of light entertainment LOL

That stuff is like a **** sandwich, tough crusty skins with **** in the middle.oh what fun I've had with it over the years.

You've not lived till you've seen a new coated carbide ripping cutter glowing orange as it melts into the job,never believe the salesman's claims they all tell lies.

LOL I can well believe it. Give me 303 s21 any day,just a pity it's mainly in rod form rather than sheet. Athough trying to convince some w/shops of that fact is a struggle.

I've spent over 30 odd years machining all grades of it and the last 2 years buying the stuff in all it's types, also buying large quantities of precision laser cut components finished and semi finished.

Ian, It's nice to hear from somebody with an obvious engineering back ground who knows the score with all these stress "thingys". As you say contacts are the best things to have. All I can say is that when I was tryng to get these made (me just walking in off the street) not one machine shop in or around Liverpool showed any signs of being interested bar one. They would be happy to make up a run of 20 but then the cost would have been £100 a set hence I went down the AF1 Racing route. If you can maybe look into this with some of your contacts I think you might be surprised at how many friends you have that want to shower you with their "gifts of appreciation".

Cheers
SPOOKY :ghostface

Did mine a long time ago

Well unless I'm missing something ( other than a job,good taste etc) then I can see no reason not to have them lasered complete,would just need the edges d/burring.

If one had the blanks made and machined the holes in then that would put the price up obviously. However the lazer guys can work to + - 0.1mm in this sort of thickness maybe closer. I can't see that being a problem as the bolts are clearance anyway and they clamp on the shafts.

It depends to a great extent what matl is used,obviously stainless would be more expensive (and considerably heavier) than alum alloy.

Pity you didn't cast your net a little wider and reach down as far as Flint N Wales,it would have been a piece of the proverbial then,I could have just piggybacked it with another order and lost most of the cost.

20 off =10 sets @£100 a set ??? the only way they could justify that would be to saw from St/Stl sheet then machine all round.

If Spoonz sends me a DXF or some such or someone sends me an old plate I could inquire as to price,although they could very well say they would only deal with an established customer,in which I would have to go and be nice to my old firm.

To be honest £50 ish + shipping for the American ones seems a bit high to me. Just goes to show why I was never the boss I guess,not got the killer instinct.

Badger said:

Did mine a long time ago

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Nice one Badger,are they the American ones ? or custom made.

Obviously if they had to be anodised as well that would add considerably to the cost as another supplier and second round of transport comes into play.