cant't flip the beast

Good man

any pics??

What elements felt better?

Over barking is natural at first and as much a part of confident knowledge of the track your on as anything else.
What I find to be the best method, is to remember that the brake isnt just on or off. Dont try to do all your barking in one, without braking markers and consistent exit and terminal speeds it can be hit and miss, in which case its better to be early then late!

Instead I find it is best to engage the bake early (just a little, so the pads make contact) then gradually increase until your near your tip in point then ease them out as you tip in ( avoid trail braking for now that will come to you naturally later ). You will see that people may come passed you, but then they brake full, and your just scuffing speed, you can use them as a guide (if they dont look like they are about to overcook it! lol) and if your slowing to quick, ease them off a touch (keeping contact) or squeeze them on abit more depending.
Doing it this way means you wont have the panic of "wait wait wait wait, ah ****! now! ahhh too soon.... or worse ARRRGH TOO LATE!"
It will also keep the bike stable, so it wont be pitching forward and back as you suddenly go from full brake to off.

Hope that helps and makes sense!

unfortunately no picture of me. i only did some video onboard. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0g0BNGNRSTI
i felt more confident through the corners i felt more speed than before but i had to keep in mind to breathe and to relax and not be tight on bars.
the braking part is not my problem i guess. the problem is that my brain does not allow me to flick it to the lean quickly enough or at the right time so i tent do go to the lean too early and too slow. i guess it is the result of being too slow already. i do not kno wif i have the chance to master it this year as the season is going to the end here slowly

Is this a trackday! Whats with the RACEGRID start?? lol thats ridiculous lol.

Do you have tyre warmers? Cause you`ve only got the first lap here. Or did you do like a warm up lap before?

What I will say is you really want to try and use all the track. The more from the outside you approach the bend the more open it will appear to it, letting you power through it. That alone will make you alot faster through a lap. Its a shame we cant see your body position though. Being relaxed is everything, and remember you actually need speed to hold you up, so you dont want get rid of all of it too quickly.

lol that is the slowest group all amateurs as me
i have uploaded only the first lap as the start was the only thing interesting about that race fro my point of view not counting one driver laping and one overtaking on the straight

i have tyre warmers and we had a zero lap and a warmup lap.
i know all that you say i just have problems to make my brain think that it is safe. i would need some practicing and shifting the borders tips. i recognised that i tend to drive like on a front wheel driven car which is bad on a back wheel driven vehicle...

p.s. got 6 points to the championship for the 9th place LOL!

What championship?

OK "shifting the borders tips"

If you have a friend you trust who can drag his knee, you could get him to do it infront of you on your bike. That way you know it can do it. Although....you have to trust the guy aint a muppet and wont push it and crash if something doesnt feel right!

What I did when I used to ride by myself and was learning was this...

Your main problem is your speed. Without speed you wont be able to lean the bike without it falling over.
First check your bike over. esply tire profile and pressures, a de-profiled tire will have you off or stop you doing anything.

set all your suspension to standard damping settings if they arent already, and just set the sag in the ball park for you.

So bike-check, tires - check. It can do it, so now we focus on you.

You want to eliminate all other elements from the equation...

so now we trust the bike. Next we find a corner we trust.
What your looking for is a long corner (roundabout perhaps doesnt work as well for this, you`l see why).
Long enough that you are in it for at least two seconds I guess. A corner that COULD be taken at between 40 -70 miles an hour (you should be able to do it a 40mph as a starting point)
It should be either flat or slightly positive camber away from distractions like busy junctions etc.
Also, very important make sures its grippy, (avoid anti slip at first though, best to learn on tarmac)

Right, so we have a bike we trust, and a bend we trust. now we begin.
Approach the bend on your most comfortable side.
ride up to the bend, with one cheek already shifted, forget your knee.
Avoid braking at first, glance at your speedo just before you enter the bend (if this might make you panic etc, or if you cant return focus to the bend etc, then this wont work for you, and dont do it!), then forget it, look where you WANT to go and complete the bend.

Now just slowly increase the speed, each time staying relaxed and listing to the bike.
If all feels fine increase again and so on. main thing, dont panic stay relaxed. Feel the front tire grip, trust the bike(if it feels trust worthy) trust the corner (once your sure its sound) and trust yourself, AND ALWAYS ALWAYS LOOK WHERE you WANT to go! Never where you will go if you f*ck up! lol (but that should be part of your corner selection, obviously pick a bend with a nice soft landing around it....if you know your a gonner if you mess up, this also wont work!)
Dont worry about accelerating out. What you need to work on is knowing you can carry speed mid corner.
You just want a swooping motion on a steady throttle, and just keep building it up until you realise your leaning more than usual and nothings going wrong.

Once you get to that point, continue but let your inside foot stick out (while still on the peg, effectively extending the peg with your foot). Your feeling for the road with it. just do this when you think you may be low enough for it to touch. If your not dont try it again until you get lower (else it may become a bad habit)
I say use your foot, because it will feel less committed than have your whole leg swinging about, and wont affect concentration so much, but once you touch it, it will no longer feel like a bottomless void to the ground, you will have something to gauge, and from then on you will know that, on that bend on that bioke in those conditions you can acheive that lean and speed. Gradually move your foot in until you feel like trying the knee and do the same thing, same corner.

Phew! hope that helps mate, try it and PM if you want letting me know how you got on! Be so much easier if we could just go for a ride! lol

man you should write a cornering book

here is a question. is there anything i can do in the middle of the corner once i realise that i was too slow in the entry of the corner? i mean to correct it.
i also have quite a problem to keep sitting in the back of the seat as the bike always shifts me with the balls to the tank. when i sit back i feel much more comfortable through the corner but it does not succeed everytime...

Lol thanks man. Thats a real compliment. I just like sharing what I`v learned. I can usually help others by identifying the problem then remembering how I overcame it when I was learning. Probably comes from being a personal trainer and artist I guess. Very sensitive to body form. Just hope its helping!

Right, as for your question I`ll PM you lol dont wanna keep bumping the thread for everyone!

stomp grips m8, dig them knees in no more ball slapping lol

If your to slow in the mid.. Go faster next time . No speed, no fun

You should open the throttle as soon as you can, no need to wait for the apex, specially if you think your slow... Just start opening, slowly but steadily, this will produce the most grip and also when you get used to it you will ride smoother and fell like you do something mid-corner, not just wait

As far as confidence, look at you tyres. If you have some meat (chicked strips) left on the front tyre... You can lean more , the bike will grip the same if its leant or if its half-leant.
Always keep this in mind.... There is just no fkin way you will lean the bike that much that it will loose grip... Even when you knees and pegs and belly pan drags, you will still have room to lean more

Stay relaxed on the bike and throw your head as far out as possible, the body will follow by itself.

(hope I didnt repeat something that top posts already said)

Gotta disagree with some of that advise mate...

"You should open the throttle as soon as you can, no need to wait for the apex"
" this will produce the most grip"

This will load and compress the rear, while unloading and extending the front.
Doing this before an apex only is a good Idea if you can already see your exit point because you are squaring off the corner. Else you may run wide and run out of road at the very least..

" look at you tyres. If you have some meat (chicked strips) left on the front tyre... You can lean more , the bike will grip the same if its leant or if its half-leant.
Always keep this in mind.... There is just no fkin way you will lean the bike that much that it will loose grip... Even when you knees and pegs and belly pan drags, you will still have room to lean more"

If there are chicken lines left on the tire yes you can lean more, (you can still lean more once there isnt, but you will be reducing contact patch) but only if there is sufficient grip on the surface your riding on, your tires are warm and any other number of factors such as camber, tire profile etc etc

It is most definitely possible to loose grip and wash out before you get right to edge on the front. You can only get that low if you have the grip available. So always go by FEEL not by the tire.

The bike will definitely not grip the same at half lean as at full lean. Its all relative, you may have enough grip to achieve full lean, but you will have more spare at half lean etc.
The lower you go the more `sheering` force will be placed on the tire, using more grip to hold line (if its available), and less room for error from pitching forward or back with throttle or brake.

Not a dig at you Dolenc, and no offence but you obviously ride somewhere which has very grippy roads, and it obviously works for you.
If that advice was for TheRuck, he rides in Slovakia where temperature is already really low, and we have no idea how polished or whatever the roads might be and if he was to take that advice on faith he might smash up his bike or worse, and we wouldn`t want that :thumbup

Im from Slovenia, so its not that far from here and as far as I read, his looking to improve his track riding, so grip shouldn't be an issue.

When you accelerate, the back actually rises it will load the rear but not compress. Opening the throttle as soon as possible is a good idea for 90% of turns, exceptions are 2 apex turns or more.

Relaying on the feel is ok, but the bikes now and tyres are a lot more capable than most riders are, so our feel is usually wrong, even if we think were on the limit and almost dragging with the helmet its still not even close to what the bike is capable. You have to be pumped up and be sure that tyres will grip to ride comfortably which (from the pics and video) is the riders main problem.

The rear will grip a lot past the tyre edge since it bends, the front is a bit different, but if you have chicken strips there, your fine.

It is always better (for the safety) to be a bit cocky, than to be scared of the bike and worried if the tyres will work. They will.

Im always open to a good debate

Im not the fastes guy out there (not even close) , but Im also not just spamming

Fair enough buddy, your entitled to your opinion. Like I said not trying to say you are spamming or whatever.

"When you accelerate, the back actually rises it will load the rear but not compress. Opening the throttle as soon as possible is a good idea for 90% of turns, exceptions are 2 apex turns or more."

I think you must be referring to rolling back on the throttle after braking? so the bike has drive, and isnt `Free rolling` no? That isnt the same as accelerating, which does compress the back, if it didnt then the forces of acceleration would be transmitted directly to the tire and overload it. (The point of suspension is the controlled transfer of force, imagine if your forks didnt compress when you braked? The tire would lock straight away, and the bike wouldnt turn because the geometry would be wrong ).
And you definitely dont want to be accelerating before you can see your exit, unless the corner is an increasing radius bend, in which case you would be gently rolling on to hold you angle and line :thumbup

But most importantly I stand by what I said not always assuming theres grip. I always go by feel. For instance if its wet etc, you feel for grip. I just dont think advising someone to assume theres grip rather than feeling for it is a good idea in any circumstance, track or not. Esply If they are at a stage in their riding career before they have yet to reach kneedown lean, and be used to the sensation of being that low. I have seen plenty of people crash, without reaching the edge of their front tire.

If your advice was just for track that is alot different (you didnt say it was, so it could be taken to be general riding advice), as it eliminates (hopefully) alot of factors. The surface should be good, the tires should be warm and correct pressure etc. Although the more you lean as I said the less grip you have for other inputs like acceleration and braking, and it will take alot less to overload the tire.

On the road you cant assume any of this, and I have been messaging him and I know that he also practices on the road (as do most people). And his next track day will more than like be in cold or possibly wet conditions.

As you say though being scared of the bike is the worst thing you can do, but thats not the same as not assuming theres grip!

Like you I`m not the fastest guy out there either! And like you I`m just trying to help the guy and keep him safe and shiney side up :devious

thanks guys i think the season is over here as it was subzero temperatures last night and during the sunny day it went to 10 max. i will try to take your advice into practice in the spring with new tyres and possibly the tank grips

Always welcome mate.
New tires very good idea. Yours may be slightly de-profiled without you even realising it where you only use up to where you are currently comfortable. Get something that works without being super hot and something with a nice linear profile (like a BT016/ equivalent) rather than a sheer side wall (like a supercorsa) as this will help confidence alot

is there any mental training i can practice in car during winter?

Hmm other than practicing racing lines not really. Asnot much will carry over from the car to the bike. Your main problem is in carrying lean and corner speed. When a car corners it "leans" away from the bend, which will be not much use in your mental training. Be patcient, re-read all the comments and spend the time making your bike is trust worthy until you can get back on it

i was thinking that my bad habits could be coming from driving a front wheel driven car... especially the gas control

If you turn on rear window heating and go to the back of the car. Then push it, you will build leg power (and you hands will stay nicely warm)

lol somar