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Reverse bleeding brakes?

Joined May 2008
684 Posts | 0+
Falkirk, Scotland
Hi folks,

Right, my front brake is a wee bit spongy and the lever has more travel than it did before I put the bike off the road back in September. Comes quite far back to the bar and can sometimes trap my fingers.

So after doing a bit of searching both on here and AF1 I'm going to reverse bleed the brakes. I grabbed a pair of plastic syringes on eBay that come with the clear plastic tubing too.

Having read through the various threads here about this method including Posh Johhny's sticky thread I understand the priciple apart from one ( probably silly ) part. So am I right in thinking the procedure is :-

  • Clean around reservoir cap area
  • Remove brake reservoir cap
  • Using one of the syringes, suck out the old fluid in the reservoir and clean
  • Fill resevoir with fresh fluid
  • Fill other syringe with fresh fluid and fit using plastic tube to bleed nipple on caliper
  • Crack bleed nipple open and slowly begin filling from syringe, watching the level in the reservoir
  • As reservoir fills up, remove the excess ( When you stop pressing the syringe to remove the excess before continuing do you need to close the bleed nipple first and then crack it open again to continue filling or is that not required ) ?.
  • Rinse and repeat until fresh, clean fluid starts to appear in the reservoir. When it does, stop, tighten bleed nipple and then refit reservoir cap. Or before refitting reservoir cap, transfer syringe over to bleed nipple on other caliper and repeat until old fluid in that side of the system is expelled and again, fresh fluid starts filling the reservoir up.
  • Once you are confident that you have completely fresh fluid now in the system, stop, tighten bleed nipple and refit reservoir cap. Job done.

Now, the "silly" thing I mentioned right at the start that I wasn't sure about is this. Obviously during this process you don't go anywhere near the brake lever and squeeze it as per the "traditional" bleeding method. So at the end of the reverse bleed procedure once all the new fluid is in, bleed screws are retightened and reservoir cap is refitted, do you just pump the brake lever a few times and thats you sorted?.

Also, is there any way you are supposed to do this in order, i.e. left front caliper first then right then rear?.

Thanks in advance folks. Hoping to give this a go today and wanted to be double sure I knew exactly what is involved. :thumbup
 
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Hi Gaz. good to hear from you again. Proceedure is spot on. When you stop pushing the fluid through, so that you can remove the old fluid from the resv then, yes, you nip up the nipple. Do not touch the levers until you have finished.

Be careful when you fill the syringe to make sure you do not create air bubble ie suck it in slowly. If you have to refil the filling syringe make sure that you do not introduce air into the system - make sure the fluid is to the top of the pipe when you push it on to the nipple. You may need to turn the bars to make sure there is no high spot in the system.

There is no order to which leg you do first.


I always use this method and find it to be dead easy, clean, and very effective.
 
Thanks for that Stu.

Wasn't sure if the bleed nipples required tightening back up when you stop to fill the reservoir up again so cheers for confirming. And then at the end once it's all complete and refitted, just pump the lever a few times and your good to go?. Cool.

What's the general thinking on brake fluid?. DoT 4 or 5.1?. I know not to use a silicon based one but I assume DoT 4 is perfectly fine for both brake and clutch?. Can't be arsed looking it up in the manual.....lol.

Gaz.
 
Hi folks,

Right, my front brake is a wee bit spongy and the lever has more travel than it did before I put the bike off the road back in September. Comes quite far back to the bar and can sometimes trap my fingers.

So after doing a bit of searching both on here and AF1 I'm going to reverse bleed the brakes. I grabbed a pair of plastic syringes on eBay that come with the clear plastic tubing too.

Having read through the various threads here about this method including Posh Johhny's sticky thread I understand the priciple apart from one ( probably silly ) part. So am I right in thinking the procedure is :-

  • Clean around reservoir cap area
  • Remove brake reservoir cap
  • Using one of the syringes, suck out the old fluid in the reservoir and clean
  • Fill resevoir with fresh fluid
  • Fill other syringe with fresh fluid and fit using plastic tube to bleed nipple on caliper
  • Crack bleed nipple open and slowly begin filling from syringe, watching the level in the reservoir



    Another silly question. Why do you have to fill the reservoir with fresh brake fluid before reverse bleeding? I mean, wouldn't it be cleverer to skip point 4 on above list? :dunno

    P.S. I speak from total ignorance as I've never done this but it seems ilogical.
 
I would agree there m8. I re-read Posh Johnny's Stickied thread on Reverse Bleeding and it doesn't mention filling the reservoir back up after emptying it. I must have picked that up from somewhere else.

Make's sense though, doesn't it?. Not to bother filling it before using the syringe with fresh fluid I mean.
 
I would agree there m8. I re-read Posh Johnny's Stickied thread on Reverse Bleeding and it doesn't mention filling the reservoir back up after emptying it. I must have picked that up from somewhere else.

Make's sense though, doesn't it?. Not to bother filling it before using the syringe with fresh fluid I mean.

Cheers mate. I actually read the original post you mentioned and, at first glance, understood the same as you about re-filling the reservoir before reverse bleeding. I re-read it again and it said to fill a clean syringe with new fluid. I will be trying this method soon in both my breaks and clutch. :thumbup
 
No you dont have to refill from the top, it pushes through from the bleed nipple. You can use this method to do the clutch but you are better off taking the slave off and pushing the piston in a few times to get the last of the air out. I have recently resorted to zip tying the clutch lever back when the bike is "resting". This seems to restore full function when ready to ride.
 
My clutch works fine and I have a MPL slave on. Do I still need to remove the slave to change the fluid?
 
Managed to get a few hours to myself yesterday so carried out the reverse bleeding procedure on both front calipers. I emptied and refilled the front reservoir 3 times for each caliper and now have completely fresh brake fluid in the system. Brakes feel a lot better at the lever and don't come anywhere near back to the bar as before. Procedure was relatively quick and easy, next time since I now know what I'm doing I reckon I would be able to complete it quicker but I wanted to make sure and take my time the first time. :biggrin

It was, I have to say, much less hassle than the traditional method. I'm going to do my back brake next and then change the clutch fluid using the reverse bleed method too. What's this I've read a few times about fiddling around with the clutch cylinder to ensure every last bit of air is removed?.
 
With the clutch you can bleed as normal - pay attention to the hydraulic lines to make sure there are no high spots - you can usually do this bt turning the bars - then remove the slave cyl. Once removed the fluid pressure will push the plunger out. push it back in with your thumb - repeat a few times - this helps to clear all of the air out of the system. Bolt it all back together - jobs a good un. If you feel there may still be a little air in the system then take a look at the banjo junction at the lever. There is a high spot in the system here where air can get trapped. ( On the brake side there is a bleed nipple but not on the clutch) In the past I have zip tied the lever back and gently "cracked" open the bolt just to let out any trapped air. Make sure you cover it with a rag. I leave the lever zip tied back now when the bikes not in use and it leaves the clutch feeling great all the time.
 
With the clutch you can bleed as normal - pay attention to the hydraulic lines to make sure there are no high spots - you can usually do this bt turning the bars - then remove the slave cyl. Once removed the fluid pressure will push the plunger out. push it back in with your thumb - repeat a few times - this helps to clear all of the air out of the system. Bolt it all back together - jobs a good un. If you feel there may still be a little air in the system then take a look at the banjo junction at the lever. There is a high spot in the system here where air can get trapped. ( On the brake side there is a bleed nipple but not on the clutch) In the past I have zip tied the lever back and gently "cracked" open the bolt just to let out any trapped air. Make sure you cover it with a rag. I leave the lever zip tied back now when the bikes not in use and it leaves the clutch feeling great all the time.

Cheers for the info, Stu.

So - You leave the bike with the lever tied back when it's stood parked up?. What, just with the lever tied back and no bleed screws cracked open?.
 
Yup , thats about it. Similar to the principle of hanging a weight off the back brake. dunno why it works but it does.
 
Cool, yeah - I had read about that before in various places but as you said, no idea why it works. I don't expect it will be long before someone comes along and explains. :biggrin
 
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