Joined Jan 2008
43 Posts | 0+
Seattle, WA
Friends
I have been conducting interviews with motorcycle-people at www.midliferider.com for some time. I just did one with Dave Richardson, owner of Moto International in Seattle, USA, Author of Guzziology, and all around super guy. He has been involved with Italian bikes since the 70s and has been selling and servicing them for 25 years. He has great insights.
For those keeping track, this is the chap I bought my RSV from. I think you'll enjoy reading what he has to say about Aprilias, Guzzis, motorcycles in general, and the people who buy them. You can read the entire interview here [clicky]
Here are some snips . . .
On owning an Aprilia and Moto Guzzi Dealership
I always tried to get out of this and it wasn’t until we had this shop for a few years that I really committed to it [owning a motorcycle dealership].
Aprilias are a great bike. They sell because they don’t have problems and they’re so good. Guzzis are in a weird place in the market because so much of the appeal of motorcycles is based on performance. The Guzzis appeal is kind of a rumble and a throb and feel. They are really wonderful bikes to ride on the street but not in a performance sense. It’s a hard thing to explain to people.
I call them the “Dr. Pepper Motorcycle.” They chase you down the street and force you to try it. “Okay, that’s good.” It’s kind of the same way with Guzzi. It’s a harder thing to sell, but it’s a happy rider once someone has it.
I like having the two brands because they appeal in different ways. The Aprilia people don’t understand the Guzzi people and the other way around. And that’s good. If you’re going to have two brands, you want them to draw from different places.
A Love Affair With Moto Guzzi
The weird thing about Guzzis, and this goes back to the 80s, I would have this dream of going there. I was somehow drawn to going there. That I wanted to save the brand. I was drawn there. [Dave is the author of Guzziology]
To Lake Como?
Yes. I’ve been there five times now. I got married in their town! I don’t feel like I’m the absolute Guzzi Nut. There are plenty of people way beyond me. But my fascination and this huge love of them is like this: Here’s something really good in the world and it’s ignored. How to make it better has become a sort of life quest for me. I spend time away from the shop trying to figure out how to make them more viable.
I write annual reports that involve Aprila and Guzzi. Well not quite annual. Maybe over the last ten years I’ve written six or seven. They’re maybe 20 to 60 pages with suggestions for new models, distribution, parts, accessories . . . Things that I would think would be good for the company.
Do I think that everything I say would be good idea and they should do it? No. But I want to put it in front of people and see if they’re consider it.
Do they?
Yeah. Well, I guess. There are some things that I see that directly relate to ideas that I have which is satisfying.
On Aprilia
I’ve heard from Aprilia that their approach is to look at a segment and the competition . . . they run their calculators and ask, “Can we build a bike that’s better than the competition for less money.” If they see that, they do it. That doesn’t mean they’re always the best or the cheapest. But that’s their approach.
That’s not to say that’s the best approach either. That’s not being inventive and having your own product image . . . who you are. You’re basically holding up a mirror and reflecting it off everyone else. That bothers me. I feel like that Aprilia doesn’t have enough individualism. They’re looking too much at Ducati. They have much more inventiveness on the scooter side than they do on the motorcycle side. More of a clean sheet vision going on.
The next generation of Aprilias will be a V-Twin based on the Shiver . . . they’ve said that engine goes 750 to 1200 ccs. It’s a 90-degree twin which will give away what’s unique with the 60-degree twin and be sort of a Ducati which it really isn’t. Rather than going with something that’s unique and arguably better, they go back to copying again.
On Aprilia Buyers
I thought when we first had Aprilia we’d have a bunch of young guys looking at GSXs who wanted to come and look at these and race around on them. It doesn’t happen.
These things are way off the map for them. I don’t know if they don’t know Aprilia exists, or they’re too exotic, or too expensive, or what it is. We’re three blocks from a Suzuki shop and we don’t get the 22 year-old kids looking at our bikes.
Here’s another problem. I think most Aprilias, and yours is a nice exception (2007 RSV100R Factory; Black on Gray], are too adolescent in their looks. You have these big lion heads, the checkerboard stuff, the flashing graphics . . . that’s all GSX stuff. In fact, GSXs have grown up and they don’t have so much of that stuff anymore.
Aprilia would be much better off if they made a good classic looking bike like the Ducati. I put this to the brand manager in the US just before he went to Italy on one of his trips. He came back and said that Aprilia views their customer as younger than the Ducati. I was shocked.
Too me, Ducati appeals to guys in our age group. The Monsters appeals to the 20-somethings. We don’t have something for the 20-something.s Maybe they think the Shiver will be that bike. But most people who I see looking at those bikes are in their 40s or 50s.
I’ve had people come in and look at Aprilias and say, “Gee everyone has a Ducati. I want to be different.” That blows my mind because I was a Ducati guy in the 70s and early 80s. I had a regular group of friends I would do vacation rides with in Portland because there just weren’t any Ducatis in Seattle. The people who had them, they were special bikes and they never rode them.
It just blows my mind that people think that Ducati is the thing everyone has.
There will always be a counter-culture bike. The Victory is for the guy who wants something that isn’t Japanese but more modern than a Harley. It’s a niche. That’s where Aprilia has got themselves. They’re the anit-Ducati. They want to be more than that, but they’re not doing a good job I think of expressing who the company is by way of being more than that.
To me, the two companies are quite opposite. Aprilia does everything to make a bike that performs well, fuss-free, low maintenance, very durable, all these things, but they don’t have any aura about them like Ducati does. Ducati has the aura.
Until the 1098 came out, we always had the faster, better bike. Now they have a bike that’s lighter and more powerful and almost the same price. Aprilia has lapsed because the situation of just being bought by Piaggio with more stuff on the way. So we’re in a hiatus time with no new engineering. So Ducati has run by us.
The other problem is that Ducati has introduced the idea of the 1200 sport bike. The Aprilia engine was designed to be as functional as it could be at 1000 ccs. It’s not designed to go bigger than that. A good move by Ducati to force Aprilia to build a whole new engine to move on.
Aprilia has such potential to have such a great aura around them. There are three classes of GP racing for motorcycles, and three for the riders. That’s six. Of the six, Ducati won two and Aprilia won the other four. How many American’s would even know that? Who the heck cares about 125 and 250?
Aprilia is involved in these classes because they always have and it appeals to young guys and scooter riders in Europe. It doesn’t do anything for us over here. They don’t seem to have enough of an idea about how to promote themselves over here.
It’s changing though. They won the ST Championship last year with the Tuono. They’ve won the first couple of races this year. They won SuperMoto this year as well as in Europe. They do well in the fringes. They need to jump into the main thing. And they’re going to.
The Aprilia V4
The whole idea with the V4 is to go super bike racing and I think they intend to race in the US as well. What it will do for them, I don’t know. Where does the V4 fit in the market?
It’s kind of brilliant in a way. Ducati has a V4 but they built it as a super exclusive bike. Aprilia has a chance to be more in the price of an MV maybe. I don’t know where this thing will be priced. But if it’s the price of an MV or the upper price of a Ducati, that’s a bargain. But that’s way more than an RSV is now. And the RSV is more than a Japanese bike.
So if the V4 is going to be thousands and thousands more, does it matter that it has all that performance? Will you sell a few more a year than the RSV? A lot more? Is it a better bike? It could be a worse market to be in. Maybe you get some press, but how many people are looking to but $20,000 bikes? I don’t know what the pricing will be. They haven’t hinted at it. It’s tough for them with the dollar being so worthless. How do you make anything and sell it for any kind of price over here?
But building a bike that they’ll only sell a hundred of instead of something they can sell many hundreds of doesn’t make sense to me.
Maybe they can build a miracle V4. There is some hope. A Four vs. a twin: It’s more a matter of how many castings you’re dealing with. The four has the same number of castings as a twin. The fact that it will be an in-house engine vs. something they buy out means it will likely cost them less.
There is a lot more of this conversation at midliferider.
I have been conducting interviews with motorcycle-people at www.midliferider.com for some time. I just did one with Dave Richardson, owner of Moto International in Seattle, USA, Author of Guzziology, and all around super guy. He has been involved with Italian bikes since the 70s and has been selling and servicing them for 25 years. He has great insights.
For those keeping track, this is the chap I bought my RSV from. I think you'll enjoy reading what he has to say about Aprilias, Guzzis, motorcycles in general, and the people who buy them. You can read the entire interview here [clicky]
Here are some snips . . .
On owning an Aprilia and Moto Guzzi Dealership
I always tried to get out of this and it wasn’t until we had this shop for a few years that I really committed to it [owning a motorcycle dealership].
Aprilias are a great bike. They sell because they don’t have problems and they’re so good. Guzzis are in a weird place in the market because so much of the appeal of motorcycles is based on performance. The Guzzis appeal is kind of a rumble and a throb and feel. They are really wonderful bikes to ride on the street but not in a performance sense. It’s a hard thing to explain to people.
I call them the “Dr. Pepper Motorcycle.” They chase you down the street and force you to try it. “Okay, that’s good.” It’s kind of the same way with Guzzi. It’s a harder thing to sell, but it’s a happy rider once someone has it.
I like having the two brands because they appeal in different ways. The Aprilia people don’t understand the Guzzi people and the other way around. And that’s good. If you’re going to have two brands, you want them to draw from different places.
A Love Affair With Moto Guzzi
The weird thing about Guzzis, and this goes back to the 80s, I would have this dream of going there. I was somehow drawn to going there. That I wanted to save the brand. I was drawn there. [Dave is the author of Guzziology]
To Lake Como?
Yes. I’ve been there five times now. I got married in their town! I don’t feel like I’m the absolute Guzzi Nut. There are plenty of people way beyond me. But my fascination and this huge love of them is like this: Here’s something really good in the world and it’s ignored. How to make it better has become a sort of life quest for me. I spend time away from the shop trying to figure out how to make them more viable.
I write annual reports that involve Aprila and Guzzi. Well not quite annual. Maybe over the last ten years I’ve written six or seven. They’re maybe 20 to 60 pages with suggestions for new models, distribution, parts, accessories . . . Things that I would think would be good for the company.
Do I think that everything I say would be good idea and they should do it? No. But I want to put it in front of people and see if they’re consider it.
Do they?
Yeah. Well, I guess. There are some things that I see that directly relate to ideas that I have which is satisfying.
On Aprilia
I’ve heard from Aprilia that their approach is to look at a segment and the competition . . . they run their calculators and ask, “Can we build a bike that’s better than the competition for less money.” If they see that, they do it. That doesn’t mean they’re always the best or the cheapest. But that’s their approach.
That’s not to say that’s the best approach either. That’s not being inventive and having your own product image . . . who you are. You’re basically holding up a mirror and reflecting it off everyone else. That bothers me. I feel like that Aprilia doesn’t have enough individualism. They’re looking too much at Ducati. They have much more inventiveness on the scooter side than they do on the motorcycle side. More of a clean sheet vision going on.
The next generation of Aprilias will be a V-Twin based on the Shiver . . . they’ve said that engine goes 750 to 1200 ccs. It’s a 90-degree twin which will give away what’s unique with the 60-degree twin and be sort of a Ducati which it really isn’t. Rather than going with something that’s unique and arguably better, they go back to copying again.
On Aprilia Buyers
I thought when we first had Aprilia we’d have a bunch of young guys looking at GSXs who wanted to come and look at these and race around on them. It doesn’t happen.
These things are way off the map for them. I don’t know if they don’t know Aprilia exists, or they’re too exotic, or too expensive, or what it is. We’re three blocks from a Suzuki shop and we don’t get the 22 year-old kids looking at our bikes.
Here’s another problem. I think most Aprilias, and yours is a nice exception (2007 RSV100R Factory; Black on Gray], are too adolescent in their looks. You have these big lion heads, the checkerboard stuff, the flashing graphics . . . that’s all GSX stuff. In fact, GSXs have grown up and they don’t have so much of that stuff anymore.
Aprilia would be much better off if they made a good classic looking bike like the Ducati. I put this to the brand manager in the US just before he went to Italy on one of his trips. He came back and said that Aprilia views their customer as younger than the Ducati. I was shocked.
Too me, Ducati appeals to guys in our age group. The Monsters appeals to the 20-somethings. We don’t have something for the 20-something.s Maybe they think the Shiver will be that bike. But most people who I see looking at those bikes are in their 40s or 50s.
I’ve had people come in and look at Aprilias and say, “Gee everyone has a Ducati. I want to be different.” That blows my mind because I was a Ducati guy in the 70s and early 80s. I had a regular group of friends I would do vacation rides with in Portland because there just weren’t any Ducatis in Seattle. The people who had them, they were special bikes and they never rode them.
It just blows my mind that people think that Ducati is the thing everyone has.
There will always be a counter-culture bike. The Victory is for the guy who wants something that isn’t Japanese but more modern than a Harley. It’s a niche. That’s where Aprilia has got themselves. They’re the anit-Ducati. They want to be more than that, but they’re not doing a good job I think of expressing who the company is by way of being more than that.
To me, the two companies are quite opposite. Aprilia does everything to make a bike that performs well, fuss-free, low maintenance, very durable, all these things, but they don’t have any aura about them like Ducati does. Ducati has the aura.
Until the 1098 came out, we always had the faster, better bike. Now they have a bike that’s lighter and more powerful and almost the same price. Aprilia has lapsed because the situation of just being bought by Piaggio with more stuff on the way. So we’re in a hiatus time with no new engineering. So Ducati has run by us.
The other problem is that Ducati has introduced the idea of the 1200 sport bike. The Aprilia engine was designed to be as functional as it could be at 1000 ccs. It’s not designed to go bigger than that. A good move by Ducati to force Aprilia to build a whole new engine to move on.
Aprilia has such potential to have such a great aura around them. There are three classes of GP racing for motorcycles, and three for the riders. That’s six. Of the six, Ducati won two and Aprilia won the other four. How many American’s would even know that? Who the heck cares about 125 and 250?
Aprilia is involved in these classes because they always have and it appeals to young guys and scooter riders in Europe. It doesn’t do anything for us over here. They don’t seem to have enough of an idea about how to promote themselves over here.
It’s changing though. They won the ST Championship last year with the Tuono. They’ve won the first couple of races this year. They won SuperMoto this year as well as in Europe. They do well in the fringes. They need to jump into the main thing. And they’re going to.
The Aprilia V4
The whole idea with the V4 is to go super bike racing and I think they intend to race in the US as well. What it will do for them, I don’t know. Where does the V4 fit in the market?
It’s kind of brilliant in a way. Ducati has a V4 but they built it as a super exclusive bike. Aprilia has a chance to be more in the price of an MV maybe. I don’t know where this thing will be priced. But if it’s the price of an MV or the upper price of a Ducati, that’s a bargain. But that’s way more than an RSV is now. And the RSV is more than a Japanese bike.
So if the V4 is going to be thousands and thousands more, does it matter that it has all that performance? Will you sell a few more a year than the RSV? A lot more? Is it a better bike? It could be a worse market to be in. Maybe you get some press, but how many people are looking to but $20,000 bikes? I don’t know what the pricing will be. They haven’t hinted at it. It’s tough for them with the dollar being so worthless. How do you make anything and sell it for any kind of price over here?
But building a bike that they’ll only sell a hundred of instead of something they can sell many hundreds of doesn’t make sense to me.
Maybe they can build a miracle V4. There is some hope. A Four vs. a twin: It’s more a matter of how many castings you’re dealing with. The four has the same number of castings as a twin. The fact that it will be an in-house engine vs. something they buy out means it will likely cost them less.
There is a lot more of this conversation at midliferider.
confused
